Zakiyyah has been a science teacher for 20 years, but has been passed over for promotion to principal.
Noha, a doctor, tells her children not to get upset when government-issued religion books tell them they are deviants.
What sets these two women apart is Islam's great divide; they are Shiites, in a kingdom whose majority Sunnis follow a puritanical code that shuns not only other religions but also other Muslim sects.
Until recently, that pecking order seemed sure to endure, despite some indications of a slow change. But many Shiites are hoping that one result of the Iraq crisis will be to accelerate the rise of democracy in the region, and more rights for their community.
The quandary is whether freedoms born of a U.S. invasion of a Muslim Arab state are worth having.
The debate is the dominant issue at many gatherings. It is tentative, rife with guesswork and conspiracy theories about the Bush administration's intentions, and voiced to an outsider only on condition that no surnames be used for fear of retribution.
On a recent evening in al-Qatif, an oasis city in the Eastern Province, a group of Shiite teachers, doctors, students, writers and businessmen sat at small tables, ate dates and sipped tiny cups of cardamom-spiked coffee, and discussed one of the many blueprints for a post-Saddam Hussein Arab world circulated in the Arab media.
That scenario holds that once the Americans finish with Iraq, they will occupy the Eastern Province, which has a slight Shiite majority and much of the kingdom's oil wealth.
Would that improve life for the Shiites?
"Most people here want a change to their situation, so if they see the Americans coming with something different, with reforms, of course they would welcome them," said Zaher.
Other guests responded angrily.
A man named Sami said the Americans had long supported the repressive Sunni royal family, and were using human rights as a pretext for taking control of the region. "How can you trust the Americans?" He asked.
Another speaker, Ahmed, was skeptical that the Americans would tolerate an independent-minded, democratic government. "We'd rather have changes that come from internal reforms," he said.
Shiites, who tend to be identifiable mainly by their names, make up 10 to 15 percent of the Saudi Arabia's roughly 19 million people and have long complained of discrimination.
The religious split goes back to a 7th century struggle over who would succeed the Prophet Muhammad as leader of all Muslims. Ali, Muhammad's son-in-law who was killed by rivals in what is today Iraq, was enshrined as the Shiite religious forefather.
The 1979 Islamic revolution in mostly Shiite Iran alarmed the Saudi leadership, which feared it would be next to fall.
In 1988, it broke off relations with Iran, accusing it of supporting terrorism and subversion. That suspicion abated after the death of Ayatollah Ruhollah Khomeini, Iran's Shiite spiritual leader, and diplomatic relations were restored shortly after the 1991 Gulf War.
Shiites say the rapprochement has had a positive impact on their lives.
Nearly all Shiite political prisoners have been released, travel bans lifted and hundreds of exiles allowed to come home.
Shiite calls to prayer can now mention the name of Ali. Authorities have also lifted a ban on the practice of whipping oneself to demonstrate grief over the death in battle of Hussein, Ali's son.
But Shiites say other discrimination persists.
It's almost impossible for Shiites to get permission to build new mosques or community halls for weddings or funerals. Shiite publications are banned. Two Shiite magazines compiled in al-Qatif have to be sent to Lebanon to be published and are then smuggled into the kingdom.
Shiites say they are barred from sensitive positions in national and local government, security agencies, schools and hospitals.
They say only one Shiite has become an undersecretary at a ministry and only two sit on the 120-member appointed Consultative Council.
Still, they are at pains to demonstrate solidarity with the government these days. They say it isn't in Shiites' interest to be seen as siding with the United States at a time when it is the object of Arab rage and is suspected of coveting the region's oil.
"The Americans are just spouting slogans. There isn't a thief in the world who worries about his victim's interests," said Adnan al-Awami, a Shiite poet.
Meanwhile, the government is seen as cautiously exploring possibilities for reform, and Shiite thinkers are hoping the Iraq crisis will accelerate the process.
A document presented last month to Crown Prince Abdullah, the kingdom's de facto ruler, calls for an independent judiciary, civil rights, free speech and elections to a consultative council. Of the 104 signatories, a fifth were Shiite.
"We are against the principle of U.S. intervention and with national unity," said Najeeb al-Khonaizi, a Shiite writer. "But we also need real reforms. We want this country to be a country for all its citizens, with no tribal or religious discrimination."